Alexander you wrote: to Me examples when people ran in for are personally known...

[Michael]

Alexander you wrote: to Me examples when people ran into drinking-bouts, vypivav in 2 years, 10 years of absolute continence are personally known. In the literature met the periods and in 25 years. Vit'kas wrote: And when the person ceases to take alcohol and on it or this its or his spiritual body height, personal body height comes to an end, it is no wonder, what even in 10 15 years as soon as to him the alcohol gets in a mouth, he starts " the dozed mechanism " or the same habit that was at it or him 10 15 years earlier. I do not believe, that the person cardinally changed and changing, will act in the same way, as earlier in 10 15 years, it is impossible! . And can be it is a question of cases when the person got in the extremely stressful or extreme situation (loss of the close person, meaning of the life, the wife zapilila, the conflict in family, depression or other injuring situation) and under influence of such situation it is broken, in spite of the fact that has passed or has taken place 10 years? And for this term can occur or happen different events, which spodvignut the person on failure much.
Though all "klinit" on a miscellaneous also that there in a head at it or him has clicked - one god knows.

[Alexander]

Certainly, the extreme situation provokes failures - about it or this and to speak it is not necessary. For this reason very important to develop or produce "stereotypes" of sober behaviour and to eradicate in itself ideas " and if... ". I here in myself shall not eradicate them while so for such situations still very much we shall wound. Sense that I (sometimes almost unconsciously, it is sometimes conscious) speak: " yes, while I am sober, but if something happens with my relatives for whom I in many respects live - and whether this sobriety will be necessary to me? " And more sometimes I start to notice, that the consciousness automatically starts "to expand" or dilate" concepts "if", is thought already " and if I will have all by way of with job ", " and if I shall not be lethally sick ", etc. until will arise " And if here she on me now well will not look or see ";)). Then - failure. Therefore, it is necessary "to prepare" for stressful situations in advance, whether chto-; to bring up in itself desire of sobriety for itself and to try to convince itself, how much or as far as it is possible or probable, that alcohol will not help or assist you to go through stress, and only it or him will aggravate... And in a stage of an active alcoholism - that a sin to conceal - these ideas "if" reached that appeared polusoznatelnaja an idea on physical elimination of the person, stirring or preventing to me " to live in the pleasure " (actually - stirring or preventing to continue suicide). And these ideas on trezvjaku frightened and gave an occasion to self-pejorative ideas - feeling of fault - failure... And so - yes... But personally on the failures - me on the use after bolee-less long remissions another usually pushed " a great temptation of an alcoholism " - I longly drank, hence, I a toper, and I can try or taste a little - next " suddenly it will turn out ". And these ideas arose just when all "ustakanivalos" - during the strong stressful moments at me the organism was on the contrary refractorier"; and here at a quiet measured life " and suddenly it is already possible " arose again and again. Still, when at me attacks " dry abstena " were observed - an idea it "is already possible" proved to be true the "logic" conclusion - " time the given deterioration samochuvstija is not consequence or investigation pjanki (10 months have passed or have taken place!) at me was not abstena, and it is simple exacerbations any " chronicles " so " chut-hardly it is already possible "... VitEk the rights that " the dozed mechanism " any more so is simple " to start " after long continence physiologically, but psychologically he can be started quickly enough. And VitEk as well rights that the person broken through so long time - was usually insufficiently improved. But I do not agree with it or him in " accuracy of a vector " perfection and, so to say, " its or his top border "." On VitKu " it turns out, that it is possible "to be improved" that completely will turn in nealkogolika, I consider or count, that the vector of perfection together with a recognition of the illness or disease is just more correct.

[Gennady]

Instead of happens such, what despite of comprehension of all negative posledsvy, despite of all interdictions and "codes", it would be desirable to drink simply and though on evening to feel "plant" without everyones there problems and zamorochek? And let all world will wait...

[Alexander - to Gennady]

Certainly, happens: (... Only " without any problems " all peerly is impossible, therefore I try to approach or suit to such desires critically.

[VA pupkin]

By the way, has read through about a dipsomania. Rather curiously. Naturally there and then in itself it or her has found out. Pulled to drink more psychologically, well and a dromomania. Often happened - saws and simply went on city (while could). And for the evening to feel a plant it would not be desirable - mesjatsok-... Can, therefore also the fifth month esperali I do not feel. Well it is impossible dream to realize - well and good. With a bottle of beer me you will not tempt. Well I do not like taste of alcohol. I remember, the first paru-always through force should be driven a three of wine-glasses

[Gennady]

No, on mesjatsok "plant" is, perhaps, search... Same how much then to depart it is necessary? No health will suffice. Strong you children or guys!

[To VitEk Aleksadru Michael]

To Alexander - I would tell or say, it is possible to be improved in view of that when that had problems with the use of alcohol, NEVER forgetting about it or this. And even it is better to use the term "was not improved and "has changed". That is the person became ANOTHER, and as a matter of fact both on spirit, and on an image and style of a life, and how much or as far as it is possible or probable in general. And time the person became ANOTHER, he means any more that earlier. To Michael " And can be it is a question of cases when the person got in the extremely stressful or extreme situation (loss of the close person, meaning of the life, the wife zapilila, the conflict in family, depression or other injuring situation) and under influence of such situation it is broken, in spite of the fact that has passed or has taken place 10 years? " - it absolutely agree, in fact unless does not happen so, as nealkogolik under influence psihotravmirujushchih the factor "is broken" and starts to drink on black? So in what difference then toper from nealkogolika?

[Modest]

Alexander, in "ZHK" is the chapter or head under the name " To avoid the dirty tricks beginning a word "if". I remember, listened to lecture on rendering the first medical care; as it is possible to avoid a painful shock at absence of anesthetizing medicines. Certainly, it is a glass of vodka:) I then any more did not drink (a little bit) and with enormous interest observed job of the mind or wit which has started to analyze heard with the purpose of creation of a situation for putting off or taking out of a painful shock with pomoshchju alcohol:))) That is how to arrange to itself accident. Very amusingly. Now I have a belief, that occasions for binge do not happen, that does not happen. Brains on a place were put by one of my spiritual instructors, its or his history. When he did not drink only 3 months, at it or him the daughter was lost. He has remained is sober. There are no occasions.

[Michael]

It is exact, and if tomorrow war and if he carried cartridges....